(0:00 - 0:17) For the past decade, our children have been the target of a concerted campaign by the trans movement. Kids are told that if they only transition, they will feel that they fit in. And their parents are told that their kids will kill themselves if they're not allowed to. (0:18 - 0:38) But both of these claims are outright lies. Fortunately, better informed people are now pushing back. And perhaps no organization has done so as effectively as Gays Against Groomers, an American anti-trans agenda movement launched in 2022 by founder Jaimee Michell. (0:39 - 0:56) So far, Gays Against Groomers has succeeded in having anti-trans legislation passed in no less than 22 states. Their website contains a wealth of truth about the trans agenda from news to scientific studies. And now, two books. (0:57 - 1:31) One of them, titled Born Perfect: Jack's Story, was just released and is the first in a planned series of children's books written to push back against the trans agenda books which have infiltrated our school libraries. Jaimee began her campaign years ago when she became dismayed at the fact that the trans movement was effectively hijacking the pride movement to the extent that many gays today no longer use the pride flag as a symbol. It used to be a symbol of equal rights for consenting adults. (1:32 - 1:48) It has become, under the agenda of the trans movement, a symbol of the victimization of our children. Jaimee, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me. (1:49 - 2:04) Jaimee, I'd like to start at the beginning. You launched Gays Against Groomers in 2022 and it's been growing rapidly since then. But before that, you were on social media and you had accrued 200,000 plus followers at the point in time at which you started Gays Against Groomers. (2:05 - 2:35) Obviously, you struck a chord with people. And so, these followers were getting, what kind of interactions were you having with them and what sort of feedback were you getting? Are you talking about on my personal, the Gay Who Strayed or Gays Against Groomers? I started the Gay Who Strayed back in 2017 because I was a right-wing lesbian. So, I came up with the name the Gay Who Strayed because most gay people are on the left and they're having a hard time getting off the Democrat plantation. (2:36 - 3:07) So, I started that account to show that not all Trump supporters were straight white men because that was kind of a myth that was perpetrating down in the United States here and still kind of is. But I think this past election really showed people that actually, no, it's everybody from all walks of life support Trump and freedom and are not on the tyranny train. So, yeah, I was grateful to be able to blow that up to over 200,000 followers within a few years. (3:07 - 3:20) And it's funny, the story behind Gays Against Groomers, I was actually getting really burnt out from posting on the Gay Who Strayed. I felt like I wasn't making much of a dent anymore. It was kind of just the same news and memes. (3:20 - 3:30) And that was when our country was kind of going to hell with Biden and everything. I just felt burnt out from it. I had been doing it for five years. (3:31 - 3:49) And so I was taking a bit of a break. And right around that time is when I started seeing these videos coming out of all these kids at drag shows and the pornographic filth in schools. And worst of all, kids being sterilized and mutilated under the guise of quote-unquote gender affirming care. (3:49 - 4:07) And I was like, you know what, I have this platform that I created. I have to try and do something about this. Because all of the gay people, all my gay friends, and even trans people that I know in my real life, we were all very much against what was happening and being done to children in our name. (4:07 - 4:39) But there wasn't really a unified front of us to speak out and be vocal and make waves basically to combat the narrative that all of us support this. And I felt like gay people and people from inside the community speaking out would be very effective at stopping all of this. Because the woke mob, the gender cult, they're very easily able to shut down parents and just straight people in general, calling them homophobic, transphobic bigots, when clearly they're not, but that's what they say. (4:39 - 4:56) And they had a pretty good success rate of just shutting the conversation down. People were scared to speak out. But we wanted to come along and show actually it's not homophobic or transphobic or anti-anything to be pro-child safety and protection. (4:57 - 5:03) And yeah, I mean, we grew. We grew so quickly. I was not expecting that at all. (5:03 - 5:29) I thought maybe in six months to a year we'd have like 5,000 or 10,000 followers and maybe some little blog would write about us. But three months after I started Gays Against Groomers, I was on Tucker Carlson on the biggest news show basically in the country, if not the world. And yeah, we were just playing catch up from the start, trying to keep up with the demand and just the movement's growth. (5:29 - 6:20) And I think that just always, to me, showed how much people were yearning for voices from inside the community to speak out and join them in this fight. Now, both with your original page, Gay Who Strayed, and now with Gays Against Groomers, have you had much difficulty in, I suppose, educating the straight community to understand that, no, you do not align with these LGBTQ+ people and their trans agenda? Well, I think the majority of the population really doesn't give it much thought. And a lot of people, you know, the backlash against our community and the support for LGBT people in America has been dropping drastically since this push to sexualize, indoctrinate, and mutilate children started happening. (6:21 - 6:46) You know, because most people don't give it a second thought. Excuse me, they see the pride flag, they see rainbow everywhere being shoved down your throats and now involving children, and they just think, wow, that's absolutely toxic. And it has to be, like, I'm against it. Things went too far. So I think it was really important for us to come in and show, like, actually, no, most of us are against it. We just aren't, you know, we don't make the news. (6:46 - 6:58) Well, Gays Against Groomers kind of does now, actually it does quite a lot. But, you know, your average gay couple sitting at home, going grocery shopping with their partner and watching Netflix at night, they don't make the news. You know, no one focuses on that. (6:58 - 7:18) You just see the viral clips going around of the degeneracy and depravity being pushed on children. And you've had to push back hard. Chris Baird, who either is or was your co-director of chapters, he publicly tore up a gay pride flag on camera. (7:18 - 7:37) Yeah. And this is just how strongly many gay people feel about this. It's not, I think the trans people, and being straight myself, you'll have to correct me if I'm getting some of this wrong, but it seems to me that the trans people who were sort of in the background for a long time, then they sort of jumped in with the gay pride movement. (7:37 - 8:15) But now they're trying to hijack it. Oh, yeah. Oh, 100%. Our community has been completely hijacked. You know, the gay people, the gays are kind of at the bottom of the totem pole now in terms of the oppression Olympics that the left loves to play. We're very low on that pole now. But yeah, the trans movement, you know, me personally, I've never understood why LGB and T were put together in the first place. I think that being gay is completely separate from being trans. I always joke and say I have more in common with a straight man than I do a trans person. (8:15 - 8:58) Because being gay is about who you love and being trans is about who you are or think you are. And so, you know, yeah, without our consent, nobody asked me or any of us, any other gay, normal gay people saying gay people that I know, if we want to be lumped in with all this insanity, me being able to marry the person I love, I has no association with people who identify as trans wanting to cut their body up and take synthetic hormones and try and tell children that they were born in the wrong body. So it's been really upsetting, you know, and yeah, Chris, he's no longer with us actually, but he did rip up that flag and we all feel that way because that flag doesn't represent us anymore. (8:58 - 9:11) It represents a hijacked movement that we don't recognize and we want nothing to be a part of. Right. Now, it is an extremely insidious and damaging message that's being given to kids. (9:11 - 9:21) And you said yourself, had you been born a couple of decades later, you might have been a victim of it. Could you expand on this? Not might have been. I know for a fact I would have been. (9:22 - 9:37) You know, I am a tomboy. I was a tomboy my whole life. I always hated dresses. I love playing sports. I didn't want to, you know, do tea parties and Barbies weren't my thing. Like I liked getting all scruffed up outside and and playing in the mud and stuff. (9:37 - 9:44) And, you know, that was fine. I loved my childhood and it was innocent. And I figured out who I was all on my own. (9:45 - 10:06) But, you know, now the thing about gender ideology, ideology and the trans movement, it is so regressive. It is telling it is basically reinforcing these rigid gender stereotypes that the gay and lesbian community has kind of been working to dismantle. Because, you know, most gay people are a bit gender nonconforming. (10:06 - 10:13) You know, like I currently still and always have worn men's clothes. This is a men's jacket. I don't wear women's clothes. (10:13 - 10:31) But had I grown up a few decades later, my school, the media, social media all would have been telling me that, oh, actually, you're a boy. You were meant to be a boy. And if my parents bought into it, bought into the insanity, they would have put me on the path of medical transitioning. (10:31 - 10:39) And I would have been a big pharma patient for life. I'd be missing body parts. And the truth is, I've never for a single day in my life wanted to be a boy or a man. (10:40 - 10:55) That that's never crossed my mind. You know, there there is no wrong way to be a boy or a girl or a woman or a man. And gender ideology and the trans movement is teaching children that there is something wrong with them because they don't fit into these rigid stereotypes. (10:56 - 11:08) And it's just it scares me and it horrifies me. And that's why all of us in Gays Against Groomers take this so personally and so seriously, because we are these kids. We could have been these kids if we were born just a little later. (11:09 - 11:51) Before we start talking about the trans movement and how it's affecting the kids, I wanted to talk about the parents, because I think you have some insights on that. We've got parents, usually moms, bringing their kids to these trans events, to the drag queen shows. What is going through their heads? Yeah, it's really disturbing. And we're trying to get through to them. Like, I think that they think that they have to do this as a way to show that they are inclusive and tolerant and all the woke buzzwords. You know, I think that I think these woke progressive moms, their kryptonite is anybody thinking that they are bigoted in any way, even a little bit. (11:51 - 12:04) Right. So they like go to the extremes to kind of show that they're not. And, you know, it's because kids are now allowed at pride and they see drag queens with kids. (12:04 - 12:33) It all comes back to the parents, though, if they would say, no, none of this would be happening. But our society has made it seem like this is acceptable and this is normal. And this is how you teach inclusivity and acceptance. And it's not. There are many other ways to do that, especially in the school system. Like I always say that the extent of teaching children anything about gay or trans or anything, the furthest it has to go is some families look different than yours and that's OK. (12:34 - 12:52) You know, some some girls like different things than you and that's OK. And vice versa for boys. Right. Like it's that's the kids. Kids don't need to have these complex ideas shoved down their throats and pushed on them. And yeah, for the parents, it's just it's it's really hard to see. (12:52 - 13:19) But I think more people are waking up to it. And I think the case against groomers has had a big hand in that. And, you know, see things that we should be. Yeah, I think we see things trending in the right direction. But we you know, it's awful to see them do this. I don't think all parents that do this are bad people. I think many of them are misinformed and lied to. You know, they the propaganda. I don't know how it is in Canada. (13:19 - 13:33) But down here with our media and just, you know, society and celebrities, it is strong. It is hard to break free from for some people. And so really kind of teaching them that this isn't the way you go to go about it. (13:33 - 13:52) We as gays and lesbians and bisexual people and even transgender people. This isn't how we want you to act to teach acceptance. Please, you're going too far. This isn't how you do it. And of course, you've had some trans people who have joined your movement. Yeah, they're disgusted with this as well. (13:52 - 14:00) So it seems to me, Jamie, that this is not really a gender identity issue. This is a victimization of kids issue. Yeah, exactly. (14:01 - 14:11) It's not it's not it's right versus wrong. Basically, it's not it's it's really that simple. You can't you can't do this to children. (14:11 - 14:19) The red line has always been kids like, you know, you don't go after people's kids. You don't try and corrupt children. But that line has been severely crossed. (14:19 - 14:36) And now you see the backlash happening against our community. And, you know, just the society as a whole. The pendulum is swinging back. Right. And we want to try and prevent it from swinging too far back. That's why it's so important for us to tell people and let people know that it's not all of us. (14:36 - 14:51) And it's actually the majority of us who oppose it. And as far as the trans people in Gays Against Groomers goes, yeah, you know, it's so funny. Our Wikipedia even calls us an anti LGBT far right extremist organization. (14:51 - 15:20) It's just so crazy. I mean, every single person in our organization is either LGB or T. But we include them for those who want to join, because, you know, we're our plan of action is just going about this in the most effective way as possible to end it as fast as we can. And, you know, trans people have the lived personal experience of what transitioning entails and the hardships it brings and the true reality of what goes into all of that, more so than even we as gay people do. (15:21 - 15:31) I mean, like I said, I have nothing in common with trans people. I can't speak to that. So we feel like letting their voices speak out against the transitioning part can often hold more weight than even ours. (15:31 - 15:46) So that's, you know, that's why we do it. We're just a big coalition trying to do the right thing and make it all end as fast as possible. We were talking earlier about the parents who are taking their kids to these drag shows and such and why they're doing this. (15:46 - 16:07) If you could sit down with one of those parents and assuming they would actually listen to you, what would you say to them? I would say that just what I was telling you earlier, I would say this, you know, this isn't how you teach tolerance or acceptance. This is actually abusive. This is introducing your children to sexual concepts and themes. (16:08 - 16:17) And it's scarring. It's actually damaging and hurting them. I would just say, you know, look, you can tell your child to just treat. (16:18 - 16:45) I mean, back to the golden rule, basically, that we all grew up with, treat people how you want to be treated. Right. Like everybody deserves respect. Some families look different and that's OK. Like these are conversations parents should be having with their children when at an age appropriate time. And it really is no place for to introduce strangers into the equation and have their children around such raunchy and sexually explicit things. (16:45 - 17:02) I mean, you know, all of this used to be common sense up until it feels like five minutes ago. But I would just tell the parents like, you know, there are other ways to go about this. You don't have to do this to appease us or to make us think that, you know, you're you're OK with gay and trans people. (17:02 - 17:32) This isn't the way to do it. So you've got a lot of great information on your Web site. You've got a blog. Of course, you have news. You've got studies that you've published. You've got two books and talk about those later. But right now, I'd like to talk a little bit about the science and the statistics and the actual facts, because I'm sure that you know them off the top of your head. Let's start with the one that the trans movement likes to throw out there all the time, which I happen to know is completely false. The idea that children who are not allowed to transition are at a higher risk of suicide. (17:33 - 17:34) What are the actual statistics?